Next, after you have learned how to defend yourself, what constitutes defending yourself, and the knowledge necessary for covering yourself legally, you must then learn what are called, “Control and Restraint” techniques, as well as the laws governing, Use of Force, and, Citizen’s Arrest, in your location. All too often people interpret such phrases as, “you may use what force is necessary to stop and detain a suspect”, as meaning they can pound on someone until he submits to their holding him prisoner. This is a grievious misinterpretation on their part. The general rule for application of force is that only necessary force may be used. When force is applied by an individual (for example, to protect life, or property), the amount of force permissible is, likewise, only that which is reasonable and necessary under the circumstances. You are not authorized to beat the crap out of a rapist, or a child molester. The amount of force that can legally be used is only that which is necessary to stop and detain the suspect. End of story. posted by Silver Sentinel @ 2:37 PM
Not a MMA Judge by any stretch but I work on the Pay-per-views at the network end. This fight is awesome & actually has a little more of a mix of Stand Up & ground then most of the Pro Fights I see which seem to go just one way or the other. I didn’t understand why it was a split. It looks to me like the guy got one choke & the rest of the time Sym is either on top of him, choking him, or using his head as a speed bag. This is one of the reasons I love patrolling with him on the rare occasions we get to. I have no problem with him being able to hold his own & he’s actually more level headed than I am anyway 🙂 Way 2 Go kid. http://youtu.be/jI2jNkB2x1E
I’ve been aware of Phoenix Jones for about a year now, since he first began whoring himself out to the media. Claiming he was a crime fighter and protector of the city of Seattle.
His arrogance and dismissal of existing, established RLSH was a bit of a turn off, to say the least.
Since then it’s been one interview after another, one news story, one more incident, he got hurt again? Lets not forget about the bragging, boasting, tooting his own horn and abuse of the media to make himself look better and sound more heroic than he really is. Plus how many heroes has he insulted by putting them down and making himself look better?
These are not the qualities a true hero, a true bastion of hope for the masses. These are the qualities of a shallow, self absorbed, narcissistic and insecure individual. These are the things a bully does. Some of his heroic acts include taking crack pipes from people. He’s claimed well over 100 crack pipes taken away from crack addicts. While I don’t support crack, and think its a hideous, deadly habit that needs to be stopped, this is not the way to do it. How does this help them? Where’s the rehab program? Wheres the support and sympathy? As far as I can see, there is none. “No more crack for you!” Sure, it may sound like an accomplishment, but how many of these crack heads were HIGH when he did this? when you’re loaded up on drugs, it’s kinda hard to fight back. This is just my opinion, that’s how I see it. Again, bully mentality. I’m sure his heart is in the right place, but his mind? his sense of reality, is not.
On another topic, keep in mind a lot of what Phoenix Jones has said has been flat out lies. He once claimed to someone privately that he had super powers, similar to Wolverine’s healing factor. Being shot? stabbed? nothing to back any of that stuff up.
I was once assaulted during an altercation with an individual, recently so was my partner Radnor. I’m sure other RLSH have too, but it doesn’t make headline news. Why? Because it shouldn’t. But I digress.
That whole story about him stopping a vehicle break in was dismissed by Seattle PD like it never happened, most likely because it didn’t.
For the last year, Phoenix Jones has tried to hail himself as the greatest RLSH of all time, which he’s also claimed to be, when he once said that all he had to do was stand around and do nothing, he was doing a better job than any other superhero out there on the streets. Needless to say, that’s a little insulting. Especially to people like Dark Guardian, who has stood nose to nose with armed drug dealers and ran them off the street, or Mr. Xtreme who helped police save a woman from an attempted rape, that perp is in prison for life. Let alone the countless other superheroes who every day and night, risk their lives (for free) to help make their neighborhoods and communities a safer, better place.
So what happens to Phoenix Jones when he tries to take on three guys and puts ONE of them in a headlock? The result is a gun pulled on him, and his nose broken. This was earlier in the year. Now why would PJ make such a stupid mistake like that? Because Benjamin Fodor (renowned MMA fighter, not really) is a GRAPPLER. He does holds and submissions, things like headlocks. Watch some of his fights on youtube sometime, you might see what I mean. He did the only thing he really knows how to do, and thats put someone in a position where its hard for them to fight back. But what about the other two guys? Well, I guess he didn’t think about that. Key word being “think”, and that’s something Ben doesn’t do a lot.
This also one of those types of incidences that completely justifies all of the criticism people give RLSH, in regards to letting the professionals handle this, or how someone is going to get hurt some day. Phoenix, you are not helping the RLSH cause whatsoever, you might just be hindering it.
Which is where I bring up my next point, where Fodor was recently arrested for assault, by pepper spraying several individuals.
And this is where I really feel the need to open my mouth. Sometime in the last two months, Phoenix Jones aka Ben Fodor posted MY video (see below) where my partner Grim and I break up a fight. On PJs facebook page, he accused ME of using excessive force because I brandished my stun gun, warning anyone who tried anything they will be shocked if something else happens. That fight ended peacefully, and no one was further injured as a result of our interjection. And just for thr record, I’ve never pepper sprayed anyone (and I do carry) or used my stun gun on anyone, let alone ever had to assault someone. I’ve grabbed some individuals to get them off of others, or helped the police handcuff people. Other than that? I’ve never had to manhandle anyone. Also that night, the police gave us thanks, respect and appreciation for our efforts that night. Shortly after the fight ended, a fire engine rolling down the street called me BY NAME over their loud speaker system. Can you say respect? Which, sadly is not what I can say for Seattle PDs thoughts of Phoenix Jones. They cant stand the guy. This was the opportunity they had been looking for to get PJ. This is a whole other discussion entirely, some of which I want to touch on. My friend Tea Krulos, who I met at Comic Con this year for HOPE 2011 was eyewitness to the whole debacle (read it <a href=”http://heroesinthenight.blogspot.com/2011/10/statement-on-phoenix-jones-patrol.html“>here</a>. My only problem with this situation is the police are not talking to the people that need to be talked to, like Tea Krulos and it seems Ben Fodors civil rights may have been violated. Thats about the extent I will defend him. But, when you put yourself out there and do the things you do, you make yourself more so a target. Even from the police, especially when you’ve insulted them bef0re, and probably made their job harder than it’s had to be, like in the above circumstance.
Lets look back on how many times he’s claimed he’s gotten hurt. I know of two specific incidences where he’s been legitimately hurt: When he got his nose broken, and when he was in the hospital for internal bleeding. That happened when Jon Ronson interviewed everyone for the GQ article. Plus the other claimed stabbings and shootings. So, iuf PJ is an expert crime fighter, who’s trained in MMA, and believes he should be the only one doing this (because of his “training”) why does he keep getting hurt? Lets look at the police, who have extensive training and procedures for situations. Sure, shit happens and every once in a while a police officer is injured or even killed in the line of duty. Usually due to some chaotic circumstance that no one could have ever forseen. The difference is that is still very rare, while PJ’s seem to be quite frequent. One person getting hurt repeatedly trying to do what he does, while an entire police force with the occasional injury. I’ll admit I don’t have a lot of hard facts to back up what I am saying here , I’m simply stating my observations and opinions.
My point here (as with every incident he’s been involved in) PJ lacks several things: training, maturity, and a grip on reality. He lives and acts like he’s in a comic book. it’s sickening and does not reflect how true RLSH act. Never have I seen or heard of any of the pillars of the community, from Superhero, to Dark Guardian to Mr. Xtreme or even Zetaman act in such a way, ever in their careers, some of which span over a decade, when Phoenix Jones was barely in middle school. But I forgot, he claims to be the first crime fighter too.
Yeah, Phoenix Jones apologized for saying a lot of those things. But why were they said to begin with? and it’s not so much what he said, but how he said it. Besides, his actions speak a lot louder than words. And I mean his irresponsible, unprofessional and dangerous behavior. What Phoenix Jones needs to do is grow up, take some pointers, and get over himself. He would do a lot better at this if he listened to some veterans instead of assuming he is better than everyone else. I’d even be willing to offer him some tips. But would he listen to anyone? no, he thinks this is a movie or something. He won’t listen, he won’t learn, and he will never get better or accomplish anything of magnificence.
Look at the NYI who has helped apprehend several serious offenders in their city. Rapists, serial assaulters. They’ve accomplished a lot. They are also dealing with the Occupy Wall Street protests and helping keep the peace there a lot. More stuff like that needs to happen.
Now as for what Phoenix did in the pepper spray incident? What he should have done was WAIT FOR HIS TEAM, break the people apart and try to deescalate the situation. NOT run in “guns blazing”. He did not attempt to deescalate the situation and only made it worse. I really hope you change your ways PJ, you are obviously not going to quit, not yet. But you went about this completely the wrong way. The charges against PJ were justified and I kinda wish they would charge him and convict him. I think this only serves to inflate his ego further, believing he is above the law and get away with more next time. Hopefully, I am wrong about that.
Here’s the video where he accused me of using excessive force:
Also lets take a look at PJ’s media. Which he’s had A LOT of. But he uses it inappropriately, as I stated earlier. He uses the media to push himself and his own image, instead of the causes he is working on. The Initiative used the media to bring attention to the Long Island serial killer, and the Xtreme Justice League used the media to bring attention to the Chula Vista serial groper, who was eventually caught.
The difference is these groups were not for self promotion, but bringing attention to a cause, to a problem. Which is what the entire concept of a RLSH is all about. Phoenix Jones would rather bring attention to himself, than any cause.
Seattle’s most famous masked crusader, Phoenix Jones, is now an unemployed superhero after he was let go from his job teaching life skills to autistic kids, and told by the state that he is no longer allowed to work with vulnerable children or adults following his arrest last month, PubliCola has learned.
“I had to leave work in the middle of the day,” Jones says. “It was embarrassing.”
Jones explained that he has worked with five developmentally disabled autistic children—who ranged in age from four to 18 years old—for the last five years at their homes and state care facilities, going shopping with them, teaching them to balance checkbooks, and going for walks.
Jones’ latest troubles come weeks after he was arrested by Seattle police for allegedly pepper spraying a group of men and women near Pioneer Square. Jones claims he was breaking up a fight, but police arrested him for assault. Following a court appearance in the case, Jones revealed his secret identity as 23-year-old mixed martial arts fighter Ben Fodor.
Prosecutors have not filed charges for the incident, and a spokeswoman for the city attorney’s office says the case is still being investigated.
Last week, Jones received a letter from the state Department of Social and Health Services, informing him he is no longer allowed to work with kids. PubliCola was not able to determine exactly why DSHS disqualified Jones from working with kids, but it appears to be due to his pending assault case.
When contacted for a comment, Jones said he had been advised not to speak extensively about the circumstances of his apparent termination, but confirmed he was no longer able to work with autistic children.
“They all knew I was Phoenix Jones,” he says.
Jones says that because of his arrest, he’s on “a list” that prohibits him from working with children, because he has “a history of interjecting myself into situations that are dangerous.”
Jones, naturally, disputes that characterization. “I would say I have a history of fighting crime,” he says. “The whole point of what I do is to keep people safe.”
Jones isn’t sure how he’ll pay the bills now. He says he’s received offers for fight bouts from the Strikeforce mixed martial arts organization, and plans to start fighting crime in the daytime, in addition to his night patrols around Seattle. Other than that, he says, “I really don’t know.”
After dramatically revealing his secret identity to a crowd of reporters following his court hearing at the county jail Thursday morning, Phoenix Jones—legal name: Ben Fodor—tells PubliCola he plans to continue patrolling Seattle’s streets, but also says he’s “training a replacement.”
Fodor says his replacement, known as Nightstick, is the strong silent type.
Fodor says Nightstick—a friend of Fodor’s from the mixed martial arts fighting world—is more interested in going out and thwomping bad guys than calling 911 and waiting for police. Fodor says Nightstick is already meting out street justice in Seattle, breaking up “six or seven crimes,” and recently left a drug dealer handcuffed to a light pole.
Fodor says ultimately he’s hoping Nightstick becomes “a guy that can function the way [he] did before [he] was outed before the Seattle Police Department.” (Though Fodor, aka Phoenix Jones, says he won’t slowing down his own crime fighting.)
Fodor would not provide any details about Nightstick’s true identity, but said he his a “mixed martial artist” who wears “head-to-toe covered gear” and “doesn’t do interviews.”
Originally posted: http://blogs.seattleweekly.com/dailyweekly/2010/11/rain_city_superhero_movement_d.php
>By Curtis Cartier, Fri., Nov. 19 2010 @ 6:00AM
Green Reaper, Penelope, Thorn, Thunder 88, Buster Doe, No Name, Catastrophe, Gemini and Phoenix Jones the Guardian of Seattle. These are the names of the costumed superheros who are now patrolling our city, ensuring your safety… I know. We’re excited too.
The PIreports late on Thursday that a group of masked vigilantes calling themselves the Rain City Superhero Movement has been patrolling Seattle streets for a few weeks now.
They wear costumes, they ride around in a Kia at night looking for trouble and occasionally, they get stabbed.
Seattle Police think they’re silly at best, dangerous at worst. They cite cases where one darkly clad crusader was nearly shot when he came running out of a park in the middle of the night, or when a woman saw a bunch of costumed freaks pull up to a gas station and thought they were there to rob the place.
“Phoenix Jones the Guardian of Seattle” seems to be the one member that the cops and the media have the most info on–and still, it’s not much.
We know he’s a 22-year-old man who met with police at the station last month in near full regalia: black cape, blue tights, black fedora, white belt and mask. He’d have brought the rest of his gear, he told them, but it was being repaired after he got stabbed trying to break up a drug buy.
But don’t worry. Jones tells the PI that he and his squad are professionals.
“I don’t condone people walking around on the street with masks. Everyone on my team either has a military background or a mixed martial arts background, and we’re well aware of what its costs to do what we do.”
The crew appears to draw a lot of its marching orders from the website reallifesuperheros.org.
That’s right, .org.
Also, another site noted by the police has an actual “manual” for becoming a super hero.
It’s packed with info on picking out fly crime fighting “threads” and weapons, assembling a kick-ass utility belt, keeping your “hero health” in tip-top shape and finding pressure points on your enemies that will render them incapacitated.
Nowhere on the site are any tips for finding a girlfriend or holding down a job.
It’s not clear how the Rain City Superhero Movement is alerted to crimes. They may have police scanners, they may have inside sources, or simply internet access to the SPD police blog. They don’t, at this point, have a skyward pointed spotlight of any kind or a direct line to Mayor McGinn.
But they do have our attention. And it’s likely that that’s all they wanted in the first place.
Blog report from Crossfire
Just got home from the police station…Heres the story
I was not in gimmick – I was in bed trying to catch a nap before work tonight. I grabbed a pair of shorts as I ran for the door and responded. I told Silver that I was in my Submariner costume.
Earlier this week my neighbor was attacked by her ex boyfriend and we were afraid he would come back to try again so we’ve been on guard. The ex boyfriend hid in the building that time and attacked them when they came home. Tonight he got into their apartment somehow and waited for them there. He was in their shower with the knife when they arrived home. He sat there for hours with his knife watching for them to come home tonight.
I had just drifted off when I heard a commotion outside my door. I grabbed a pair of shorts and my nightstick and ran out the door. I could hear fighting from the room across the hall. The downstairs neighbor came running up and I told him to call the police. I banged on the door with the nightstick and the young lady opened the door. She had been cut on the hand and was covered in blood. She shouted “Help us!” and pointed to the living room.
I ran in and found her boyfriend struggling with her ex boyfriend who had an eight inch knife. They were half on the couch with the knife between them and the blade was between the boyfriends shirt and his skin. The boyfriendwas holding the blade away from him and had the ex pinned to the couch with his bodyweight.
I stuck the nightstick between the blade and the man’s chest and ordered the ex boyfriend to release the knife. He refused and I told him several more times. I noticed that he had released his grip on the blade a little and asked the girlfriend to grab the knife if she could get it. He tightened his grip and I moved the nightstick and put it to his forehead and told him “let it go NOW!”
He dropped the knife and we wrestled him to the floor and held him there until the police arrived.
When the police arrived the neighbors told them that the superhero stopped him…they said I was going to trade my clown suit in for a cape. (None of them know about Crossfire yet…LOL)
The perp has been arrested and the young lady is safe once again.
I got a good laugh at the station as I heard the perp telling the officers how the fat guy with the bat took his knife away.
That’s the story and now Im dealing with an adrenaline hangover…and I gotta get ready for work.